From Burnout to Breakthrough: Nick Tintle's Lacrosse Journey, Part I.

In this episode of 'Get the LAX Scoop,' hosts Big Dog (Ron Doglish) and Jaybird (Jay McMahon) are joined by Nick Tintle, a former standout lacrosse player who shares his journey from early struggles to collegiate success. Tintle, a two-time All-American midfielder at UNC, details his path, including the challenges he faced with team culture, his leadership evolution, and a defining moment during the Empire State games. After UNC, Tintle experienced personal hardships, leading him to move to California where he rediscovered his passion for lacrosse and began a career in strength and conditioning. Now, as the founder of Lacrosse Barn in Dallas, he imparts his hard-won wisdom to the next generation of athletes. The episode explores themes of adversity, leadership, and the importance of focusing on the process over outcomes.

00:00 Introduction to Get the LAX Scoop

00:23 Meet the Hosts: Big Dog and Jaybird

00:43 Special Guest: Steve Grisolfi

00:59 Lacrosse Season Update

02:02 Guest Introduction: Nick Tel

04:45 Nick’s Early Lacrosse Journey

08:22 Influential Figures in Nick's Career

11:42 High School Challenges and Triumphs

15:44 Recruitment and College Decision

22:13 Reflecting on Carolina Lacrosse Experience

24:11 Lessons in Leadership

27:47 Mindset Minute: Process Over Outcome

33:48 Overcoming Adversity: Post-Carolina Journey

41:05 Finding Purpose in California

45:04 Full Circle: Returning to Lacrosse

46:19 Conclusion and Teaser for Next Episode

NEW BOOK!
Inside the Recruiting Game: Insights From College Lacrosse Coaches
-Available on Amazon.com as an Ebook and paperback


Links to training videos:
Master The 5 Best Dodges From the Wing!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k_7LDOcQQ6Q&t=88s

Blazing Shots... on the Run!
https://youtu.be/XiptPlM63oQ

Check us out...

On YouTube @jaymcmahonlax23
On Instagram @jaymcmahonlax23
On Facebook @: facebook.com/jmcmahonlax23. Page name: Jay McMahon Lacrosse

Check out!... Coach Tintle's Lacrosse Barn:

https://g.co/kgs/eXedCXf

SuccessHotline with Dr. Rob Gilbert on Ironclad & Apple Podcasts

Brian Cain Daily Dominator on Apple Podcasts

Jon Gordon Positive U. Podcast on Spotify

Mindset: The New Psychology of Success, Carol Dweck, PhD on Amazon.

Lacrosse Charities Mentioned in S2 E36:
https://www.4thefuturefoundation.org/

https://www.harlemlacrosse.org/

https://15forlife.org/

Transcript

0:00

It's time for Get the Lack Scoop, a podcast bringing you all the people and stuff you should know in the game of lacrosse. We take lack seriously, but ourselves, not so much. Join host Big Dog and Jaybird and the biggest names in the game brought to you by Jay McMahon lacrosse. That's JML skills, mindset, and lacks IQ training. Ron Doglish, the big dog, was a collegiate football and lacrosse player at Brown. He was also an assistant lacrosse coach and the executive director of the Sports Foundation. And Jay McMahon, the Jaybird, a three time All American midfielder at Brown. He was the captain of the U. S. Junior National Team and is the founder of JML. And Joining us in the studio, Steve Grisolfi, who's collegiate lacrosse career statistics equals one goal against Dartmouth brought to you by Jay McMahon lacrosse. That's JML skills, mindset, and lacks IQ training, helping the next generation of lacrosse players get to the next level. LAX fans, we're excited to have you back for another episode of Get the LAX Scoop. Jay. We're well in into March now. The season is heating up. Absolutely. It was an exciting time to talk lacrosse. Very exciting. I think. Are you wearing a Tar Heels shirt tonight? You better believe it. Jay that is like, really, that's really rubbing, that's a hint. The face of, our good friend Lars Tiffany, who's off to a rather difficult start the heels. Yeah. And you know how the heels, you mean the hooves When I talk about my friend Joe Brushy down there at Carolina, but they seem to be one of the early season favorites. Jay. I'd have to agree. I've been watching the heels. They're looking dang good. And the who's, you know, they're a work in progress. It might surprise some people. Well, let's mark that in the history of get the lack scoop and early. I agree with Ron statement. There doesn't happen much happen often. Jay, for God's get onto the introduction and our guest please. Yes, dog. We're very excited for our next guest. He hails from Levittown, New York on Long Island. As a senior at MacArthur High School, he was an All American selection in lacrosse as well as the midfielder of the year from Nassau County. He was also an Allstate selection in football and rushed for over 2000 yards as a senior. As many accolades earned him a lacrosse scholarship at the University of North Carolina, where he was a two-time All-American Midfielder. In 2008, as a senior, he served as a captain and by Season's End was named CO MVP of the To Hills. While in Chapel Hill, he led the team to two NCAA tournament appearances. Following graduation, he became an exercise in lacrosse trainer at Athletes Choice in Southern California. Shortly thereafter, he held an ownership stake and management position at this facility where he served until 2022. Over the years at Athlete's Choice, our guest impacted literally thousands of lacrosse players helping many boys and girls achieve their dream of playing college lacrosse. After taking a break from playing competitive lacrosse himself for a number of years, he felt the deep desire to get back to the pursuit of something that had alluded him all his life, which was a championship season. After three years of play, it was mission accomplished as he helped the Denver Outlaws win the major Lacrosse league championship in 2018. Most recently, he's relocated to the Dallas, Texas area where he opened the lacrosse barn. The Lacrosse barn is a premier lacrosse performance facility spanning 3.3 acres with two buildings in over 80,000 square feet of space, all exclusively dedicated to the lacrosse athlete. He and his staff offer a top tier lacrosse experience enhancing the potential of every athlete they mentor. Teaming up with elite strength and conditioning coaches, as well as physical therapists. Their mission is to deliver the finest training experience in the lacrosse world, crafted by lacrosse players. For lacrosse players. Please welcome our next guest, the Ms, the me, the maestro of lacrosse training. Nick Tel, welcome. Thanks guys. I appreciate it. That was a, a great intro. Hey, Jay, did you just say the Miz? The ma. The ma. He's the maestro. That might be the dorkiest thing I've ever heard. Ron, you loved it, Nick. Poetry emotion. I'm sorry. It had to be had guys. One of the greatest, if not the greatest. We just had Jamie Monroe, so we're getting, he know, he knows he's great. He's, he knows he's great. Jay the, he's a MAs. All right, Nick really cool to meet you and great to have you on tonight. And one of the things we love to do, you know, hearing about your lifelong passion for the game is all of us have that lacrosse origin story. Like you remember who was, you know, when did you first learn about the game? When did you first develop that passion for the game when you were a little tyke on Long Island? So, I, I guess it started, so I started in fourth grade, which I guess is a little late for Long Island kids. But I still remember my first stick. So we were a family friend is Joe De Simone with lacrosse Unlimit and Rob Rimmer and those guys. Oh, yeah. Yeah. So, so my first stick was a u, like A-A-S-T-X Viper, and it had the UNC, it had UNC die on it, like the lacrosse. Really? Yeah. So I was, I was a Michael Jordan fan since I was, as long as I could remember, I wanted to play basketball, Carolina. That didn't work out, but I played every sport you could think of. Lacrosse, to be honest with, with you, was my least favorite sport. And I think that goes into the prerequisite of mastering your skillset, right? So from the beginning, you know, you handed me a football, I ran around people. You, you put a basketball in hand. I, I mastered dribbling and I was able to use my athleticism to get to the, to the rim. Baseball, you know, I was fast. I was good, good fielder and, and was able to get on base and I was fast so I could steal base and stuff like that. But lacrosse for some reason challenged me and it challenged me early. It was the kind of the sport that your athletic athleticism doesn't shine through until you master the stick. And I really didn't take it seriously. I had fun doing it, I remember, but I didn't, I didn't love it. Mm-hmm. And, and really where I went through is I, I, where, where it kind of, so in middle school you had to make the choice of baseball and lacrosse. And my dad has a baseball background and he told me whatever sport I choose, you know, he'll support. And I, I chose baseball. And at first, and then a couple talks with some coaches and, and you know, some other people, they, they persuaded me back to the lacrosse journey. Nice. Got you. Back on the straight and arrow, thank goodness. Yeah. When I was in se, so when I was in seventh grade, my mom used to walk the track and, and Salk and and MacArthur are right next to each other. So Salk has a big wall and I used to hit the wall for 30 minutes and then go shoot for 30 minutes while my mom walked the track. And between that seventh and eighth grade year, from seventh to eighth, you know, I was up there five days a week or an hour a day and, you know, nice. When, when I got back in eighth grade, I kind of started. Athleticism started to take over. So I think that was my, my first seventh, eighth grade was when I really started to pay attention to stick work and really, really dive in. And that's when I really started to enjoy the game. That's great. I think it can be tough with young kids too, when you have all these other options. And lacrosse is challenging, especially when you're young and back then usually you're playing on these full fields. And I didn't start till a little later than you, but I was training my son or coaching his team when he was in second, third grade. And just being on that huge field, they're getting whacked with a stick. It can be tough to get kids some traction and get them feeling good about it. Yeah. And I think you know, we get a lot of I, I see it even harder when you get to seventh, eighth grade. So if a kid picks it up late,'cause I, you know, I've been in California and Dallas, you know, the last 15 years and we, we recruit kids that are athletes from other sports and they almost get so discouraged even though they dominate other sports. They get into lacrosse and they see. Guys that they know that they're more athletic than that are way ahead of them because of that lacrosse stick. So you gotta keep them kind of on the, you know, keep'em confident enough to get through that prerequisite of that, you know, that one year dedicated to getting that stick stick up to par. Right? Yeah, absolutely. So I mean, Nick, you mentioned I think a couple of folks, but also, you know, interested in who some of the important people were in your life. As you said, you almost, you almost went down that boring baseball track stand around sport. So glad I didn't do that. But who were the, who were the people who influenced you, you know, in that lacrosse journey? And obviously you were a multi-sport athlete and you know, I know in a lot of schools you got guys who coach multiple sports. So I'm wondering who the, who were the people that really influenced you in your journey? So, yeah, so I would start with my dad's the biggest influence. He's, he was my coach for baseball and football. He pushed me really hard. He was really, really tough on me, and It was, it was tough when I was a kid. I look back at it now and I can't thank him enough. So I, I'd have to go with my dad for that. And then, like I, I call him my second dad is, is Scott Rogers' senior. So Scotty Rogers the gold from, not Dame, his dad was like a second dad to me. He got me into strength and conditioning with Scotty. So without the strength and conditioning piece, I probably would've never got recruited. So he was a big part. You got Ken Miller who does the Long Island Sting. You know, we, that was like, club was just starting really to take off when I was in high school. So I, I joined with them and, and that was a, a bunch of guys from Levittown and Wonton and then a couple other places in Long Island. So that was, travel was just kind of getting a start back then. 2002. Yeah. From what I remember, it was Long Island. Long Island Sting was your Nassau County Boys. And then Team Long Island was the Suffolk County. And that was like Jamie Allen and and Federico. I think I played for a season with them and then it was just, it was too far and we had the sting right next door for, to me. So but then Joe McDermott was a coach for the Sting Gordon Purdy. Oh yeah, yeah. Gordon Purdy got, was was a coach of mine for a little bit. Crazy. I think he threw a a long pole at a ref one game. Really? Yeah. Like javelin through, threw it across the field. Wow. Yeah. We used to play against him when he played for Delphi, so he, yeah. Yeah. He's an OG like us. Yes. That's funny. Warren Pur. And then my high school coach was Chris Bergeson who played at Hofstra. He was, he, he, he was great for me'cause he wasn't. Like my other, like, he wasn't like my dad, he wasn't like other coach. He wasn't like type A. He was like, he's like kind of, he kind of allowed me to find my game and, and let me be creative and, and kind of find my style. And you know, he, I was a midi my whole entire life. When I moved, when I played varsity as a freshman, I was underside, so he put me on crease attack'cause he knew I could play, but like wasn't ready for maybe, you know, dodging the bigger guys and stuff like that. So I was kind of an inside finisher. Mm-hmm. Which, which also sucked because John Ner was, was a senior at that year and he played at Navy and John Ner was with the No look Pass. So I got case in the body, like I couldn't catch his pass and he would get so pissed off of it. Right. He, he was actually just here in Dallas coaching Culver against Highland Park and I got catch Oh wow. Him, we had to catch up with him, which I haven't seen him forever, so it was good to catch up with him. But that's neat. Coach Ferguson and then my youth coach, you know, seventh and eighth when I really started, or sixth and seventh when I really started loving the game was, was Coach Bob Ello. So I've had, I've had a lot of really good coaches in, in my youth days. That's great. Awesome. And as you mentioned, you were a little undersized coming in there as a ninth grader and into high school, and that it had started this breakfast club routine with another good buddy of yours. So why don't you tell us about that story and, and the impact it had on you? So, to rewind a little bit, like, I went into high school wanting to be a football guy. Like that was my, that was my number one sport. I wanted to play football at the next level, and I entered high school as 119 pound kid, so, right. Wow. No, I was su I was good in football and, you know, I was quick, I was fast, I was athletic. I just, you know, the size catches up with you in that, in sports like that. Right. So I guess this coach had, a great deal of I don't know. Like I, he's a big part of why I, I got better on both the lacrosse field and football field. But he just did it in a different way. He, he pretty much told me I would never play varsity football. And he goes, I would never start, I'd never see the field. You're too tiny. All, you know, kinda, again, not type a way, but like, it was like a different, like I could handle guys yelling at me mm-hmm. But telling me I couldn't do something was a new, and he would do it very nonchalant and it really pissed me off just like, yeah, you, you're never gonna make it. Oh. That kind of thing. That was like, he was so nonchalant, like, oh yeah, okay, 10, oh, you're too small, you're never gonna play by. I was like, it just drove me. So me, and we probably could see you getting fired up and being like, okay, it's working. Alright. It hit a, it struck a nerve for sure. So. So Coach Farney, who was our foot, our JB football coach, I broke my collarbone for freshman year of football on jv. Mm. And that's when I realized, okay, when I get out of this sling, I gotta do something about it. Like, I, I would come home in tears to my parents and like, they would be like, well, crying's not gonna do anything about it. Complaining or blaming other people are not gonna do anything. Like what's the solution? So that's where it all started. It is like, I just was like, all right, well, I'm too small. What do I have to do? I gotta hit the weight room. Mm-hmm. So Coach Farney would open the, the, like we went, we approach him and he, he would come in early and open it up for me and Scotty Rogers and we would get in there and he'd put us through a lifting program. And when I started that, I, you know, it was tough at first, but then it became just a part of my day. So I didn't miss a day in the weight room at five 30 in the morning after I got the o out of that sling for the next four years. And I ended up gaining 20 pounds every off season. And you know, I was a late bloomer, so by the time I was a junior I was, you know, one 70 and decent sized. Still kind of small, but. Strong enough to handle stuff. Right. And my athleticism took over from there. So that was a big, a big, that was a big part of my success, Jay. Great. Two takeaways that of maybe why I was not as great a player as I could have been. First of all I think I, I haven't been 119 pounds since second grade. And I don't think I was ever in the weight room at five 30 in the morning rbo No. Yeah. It's just, it's clear, Jake, it's clear now we know where greatness comes from. That's when I get older. Doesn't come from all those ese peanut butter cup cups you got by your bedside. That's good stuff. And then so Rogers, was it Scotty Rogers? He was the, a big goalie for Notre Dame, right? Correct. Yeah. That's, that's cool. Scotty's been a friend of mine for a long time. That's awesome. So the two of you, and he's a, he's a big guy, right? Yeah, he is a, he is definitely a big guy, but I would always. You know, I'd always challenge him on the body weight stuff. So like Pullups, you know, big guy long. Oh, right. He's hard. He can't see that dog Pullups as 119 pound little guy, so. Right, right. We would push each other in different things. He would get me on the bench and I would get him on the, the pullups. That's awesome. That's great. That's, that's a great lax buddy right there. And then he would've been probably on the team when they were in the national championship game, right? Correct. Yeah. Was that, yeah. That's cool. That's awesome. And so let's see. Oh yeah, so, so Jay who likes to follow the script is getting lost. Well, you know, I just want you to, I'm waiting for him. It's his, his question trying to stick to the script tonight. True. I thought I was wrong. So he doesn't know what the hell he's doing. He just keeps telling you. That's great. That's nice. Zip it. Zip it. I got the next question. So Nick you mentioned a little bit about travel across, starting back then. Was early recruiting going on back then? Like what was it like and if so, no. Okay. If not, then you'd still being a little undersized, like someone like Scotty Rogers who was probably big back then. Did you notice a difference?'cause it's really impressive that you got to UNC, you know, with a scholarship. You know, we know Dylan Malloy from Brown. He was a little undersized, but you know, he kind of got passed up at, you know, kind of slipped through the cracks a little bit. So tell us a little bit what recruiting was like back then. So 2003, 2004 or something like that. Right. I graduated 2004. Yeah. Okay. So the recruiting, the recruit, well, 2000, yeah, 2003 would be my junior, so 2 0 2 2003. So the recruiting process was way different than it is now. Obviously. It's, it's kind of a crazy thing now. I wasn't stressed about I can't tell you where I was thinking at that time, but like I, I know that I wasn't worried about it. I knew that someone would find me and all I had to do was control what I can control, get in the weight room, get bigger, get stronger, get faster, and then work on my, on my skills. So I was not recruited. I was also, I was kind of like blind to it. Like I wasn't, like, my parents didn't push it or anything like that. They didn't like, it wasn't like it is today. With, with the, the parent influence, my parents just let it be, and I guess I didn't realize it until, so they, they had the Long Island Empire team, which they don't have anymore, but the Empire team is pretty much like a nine tryout thing. If you make all county, you get like one tryout off and then you come to the second round of tryouts and, you know, I saw some really good guys before me, like the year before Danowski and those guys and you know, some guys making like, that was like, like my goal, like make that long on empire Team. So I, I, I discussed it with my high school coach and I was playing attack at that time. And, you know, there's, they're three attack and they're gonna take probably five to the Empire game. So you're, you're, you gotta be the top five. So I thought I was gonna have a better chance at moving to MIDI for the trial, which I did. Right. I'm gonna take, you know, eight or nine guys probably. So I, I changed to midfield and I made it to the last round, then eventually got asked to be on the team. And I think that was the biggest breakthrough for me recruiting wise, because I wasn't getting letters or anything like that until I made that team. Mm-hmm. And really it hit when we went to the games and we were playing, we were down to the the upstate team. We were down at half or something and I took the huddle and you had guys like Steven Pser gonna Hopkins and. Some guys gonna, Georgetown and Syracuse, you had Pat Parrot gonna Syracuse and these guys were already committed. And then a lot of other guys were, you know, there's a bunch of Carolina guys and they're like, what, who's, who's contacting you? Who's reaching out to you? I'm like, Nope. I haven't got a single letter. But I remember halftime, I, I took the huddle over and I was like, you need to step it up. Like we're the best, you know, we're the best in Long Island. Let's represent that. And like, I kind of took a leadership role against guys that like, we're already committed that I should Right, right. They should probably me like to pick, pick it up. But that's strong island dog. Yeah. And I think that was a, I, I remember letters getting it. It was like, we like how you led that Long Island team and you were, you were vocal in the huddle. It's like, that was a big part of my, my recruiting process is what I remember. Right. I was on that Empire team way back when I was around and that was pretty much the only time coaches saw you. So interesting. Yeah. Nick ne Jay never also misses an opportunity to, you know, tout his own career. Well, I didn't mention I was Midfields of the year also in Nassau County. I didn't say that. And, and he, and he just proves it over and over again. Nick, you know, I was holding back. He's a shameless complete shamelessness. Connecting with our guest Ron. We have things in common so Nick, it, it is really cool to hear about, and it seems like, I'm sure this is the kind of thing you talk to the kids that you train all the time. You know, you're, you're a guy who's not even getting recruiting letters and then you go on to North Carolina where you're a two time all American, a captain Co MVP of the team as a senior, you know, playing in a couple of NCA tournament you know, a couple of NCA tournaments. So, you know, whether you're getting a letter or not does not define whether you can and will be a great player. But tell us about the decision to go to Carolina and you talked about being a Michael Jordan fan and having that first stick with the Carolina Blue, but what was the decision to go to Carolina and what were some of, you know, your great memories from that experience? So, yeah, wanted to go to Carolina as a little kid, so if they offered me, I would, that's, I was saying yes, and that's pretty much what happened. Right. So I was talking to Virginia and Maryland. I was talking to Coddle and, and Dom Staria and I got off the phone with them. Yeah. I just set up, I just set up visits to go to Virginia and Maryland, and I get off the phone and Coach Hos calls me for Carolina, he says, so I had to go to committee to get in Carolina. My SATs weren't of the best, so they had to like fight for me to get in and, and so on. So I was waiting for hear from'em. So Coach Hoss called me back literally right after I got off the phone with, with those two coaches. And he goes, Hey, we got you in. Do you wanna be a Tar Heel? And I, I instantly like, yes, like wow. And so I had to call Coach Star Jeba and Coach Coddle back and tell him that I wouldn't be coming. And honestly to, to just, you know, those are tough calls to make. Tell my story, I have to tell you is that I wish I went to those visits at the very least because I can't tell you that I, you know, I. I made my decision on a school based off the best basketball player to ever play the game. I didn't base it off. I didn't base it off. Who are my coaches for the next four years? Who are the other guys going there? What kind of educate, like what do I want to do with the rest of my life? Well, what, what's my, what's my major? I made the decision because I wanted to go to Carolina. That's it. I wanted to wear the Carolina Blue, and I wanted to wear the number 23, right? So, I don't know if I would, I, I don't know if I would've been at Tar Hill if I went to those other guy, like Virginia was a second, like a very second cl like, you know, close in the running. I don't think Marilyn was, my top choices, but I just, I should have just gone and experienced something else. But my Carolina experience was, was great on the lacrosse field. Not, not what I wanted, not what I expected. I, I wanted to win a national championship, you know, everyone does. I think the culture was a little bit. Not what I expected, unfortunately. So, but you know, being at Carolina, being a Carolina alum, I couldn't be more proud. Like I, I loved the school, I loved my buddies that I graduated with. I just, the lacrosse experience wasn't, wasn't what I wanted it to be, to be honest. Mm-hmm. Culture wise? Like, what was it that was lacking you think, while you were there? It was culture wise, I'm, I'm from Levittown, blue collar kid. It wasn't, it was, it was a soft culture. It wasn't tough. I was more of like in between the lines guides. I wasn't your best offensive guy. I wasn't your best defensive guy, but I was really good at both. And you're gonna get 110% outta me no matter how good the coaching is or how bad the coaching is. Or you know, you, I'm showing up and I'm gonna give you everything I have. And I just, the, the, the biggest thing for me, and it's, it's not to call out the other guys that were at Carolina. It starts from top to bottom, but they weren't all in. We were there, there was a lot of guys that were half in and, and a lot of the guys that started were the guys that were not all in. And that, for me, I'm okay with losing as long as I give it my best effort. Right. And when there's, when you're in a team sport and you're, you're trying to get everyone to give their best effort, and half guys are are just going through motions, it's, it's a tough pill to swallow.'cause we have the top five recruiting class, you know, top, top 10, recruit, whatever, you know, we, Carolina always is in the top recruiting class. Right. And for some rea for those four years, even when we did make our periods to my junior and senior year, we, we underachieved and I mm-hmm. It still bothers me that we underachieved. That's the only, that's the thing that bothers me most is there's not achieving part. Right. I gotcha. I, I was gonna actually ask you, but I think you, you kind of alluded to it here, but you know, while on the top line of that. That lacrosse resume, so to speak. You know, you're saying, Hey, two time All American Captain Co, MVP and say tournament, what a, what a career, you know? But it seems like, you know, there, there was adversity and difficult times. So, you know, what did, what did you learn from all that you know, both the highs and the lows at Carolina that maybe you bring with you today as you're working with so many young kids? I learned that leadership is the, the path less taken. I think it's a thing that you have to learn and continue to learn. You never end up at being at the top of leadership. You're always gonna have to learn more and, and adapt. Going from high school, I led by example 5:38 AM workouts being the hardest worker in practice. And other guys bought in. In college, that doesn't happen as much. You can't lead by example. You have to be a little bit more vocal. And, and I regret not being more vocal with guys and getting that, you know, getting them in in shape and stuff like that and, and getting them on one on the same page. We tried, I remember. And I was like, look, you know, and, and it's, I don't talk about coaches'cause, you know, my coaches were great. Like, it, it's not that, it's just the coaches lost the locker room. And for me to be a captain and try to glue those pieces together, it just was almost like an impossible task. Mm-hmm. So I, I drive myself crazy thinking about what I could have done differently to get a different outcome, but you can only you know, do so much. You know, we, we tried to get the guys to say like, Hey, we're the guys on the field. Like, we're the ones playing, it doesn't matter about who's coaching us or what. It's, it's about us. So let's play for guy next to us. And we, we tried that thing, it just. You gotta put a full on effort from the day you step on campus to the day you leave campus. And, you know, fall balls were loose and guys were hanging out and going out and partying, including myself. And, and it just wasn't, the winning a national championship wasn't the ultimate goal. It was, it, it just wasn't there. Mm-hmm. Right. But that kind of natural leadership ability for you seems to have really kind of, the cream was rising at the top, I guess, ever since that Empire State game scenario. And then you were a captain at MacArthur and then, I mean, as you said, it's, you could, you must have been a great leader. They voted you to be one of the captains, but if you've got 60, 70% of the, the other guys just refusing to come along, there's only so much you can do, I imagine. Yeah. And that's kind of what I learned it's led me on the path of my coaching now to be, to, to allow these kids to understand that being vocal. It's hard to get guys to buy in or girls to buy in on the team and do the things necessary not even, I don't even talk about winning. I talk about maximizing potential, right? Right, how do we, what are the little small details that give us an edge over our competition? How do I maximize my potential? Whether that is a role that I have to take on fully or if I have to produce a certain amount of, you know, goals or to sit, or if I have to get ground balls for my team. Like, taking on that role and going all in with it. Not thinking you have to be the, the best player on the team, but, but take your role. And I think I learned that more with the Denver Outlaws than anything. I had to play a certain role that I wasn't used to playing, but I was gonna do my best. I. Play that role and do my job and like, that's like Bill Belichick will bring him in'cause he's at UNC now, which is awesome. Right. Do your job and do your job. Does their job you got, you get a good outcome. Right. Controlling what you can control. Right. You know, letting go of the winning or losing, it'll take care of itself kind of thing. So, yeah. So that's interesting. We transitioned to, uh, JML. And let's do that. We'll get into a little bit of the mindset. We'll do a mindset minute

MacBook Pro Microphone-2: 27:47

today's mindset Minute comes from one of Brian Kane's, 10 Principles of Mental Performance Mastery. Dr. Rob Gilbert mentored the great Brian Kane in the sports performance field. Brian Kain has worked with Cy Young Award winners, Olympic Gold medalists, and with the Yale Bulldogs men's lacrosse team in 2018, the year they won the national championship. The principle was just mentioned by Coach Tinel, and it is focus on process over outcome. Many coaches and players will take pause when they hear the recommendation to not focus on winning. Hey, if we don't focus on winning, we're not gonna be competitive enough. Well, three of the most successful coaches of all time, Nick Saban, John Wooden. And Coach Bill Tierney all focused on process over outcome. Brian Cain takes a quote from Nick Saban's book, how good do you want to Be? In which he said, becoming a champion is not an easy process. It is done by focusing on what it takes to get there. Parentheses, the process not on getting their parentheses, the outcome coming from a guy who's won seven national titles. That's a powerful statement. The best coaches and trainers in the world see the process as a staircase. They climb each day staircase. They reverse engineer from their long-term goals, such as winning a national title back to their short-term goals, such as getting better at rides and clears In today's practice, the best of the best focus on the outcome 20% of the time. While focusing 80% of the time on today and the steps they must take today to get the outcome they desire, the foundation of a process over outcome mentality is controlling what you can control. Being relentless about focusing on what you can control and letting go of what you can't as quickly as possible is one of the fundamentals that elite performers possess. Brian Kane states in his mental performance mastery course. If I could hammer home only one point with a client, this would be it. Get clarity on controlling what you can control to become peak performers yourself, or as a coach to help your players achieve their goals. We must learn how to differentiate between what we can and can't control. When and how this strategy is used. Well, when we start to see the tendency in ourselves or in our players to blame things outside of our control for our struggles, that's when we use it. It's our job to realize that putting time and energy into things we cannot control is wasting both of those precious resources. Focusing on those non controllables is a self-defeating game. To begin as a player or coach, make a list of everything non-controllable that you face that may impact your results or ability to achieve your goals. You'll probably think of things like the officials, the fans, the other team, the amount of playing time you may be getting as a player, field conditions, the schedule, et cetera. Ask yourself or your players, what should you do with all those things? If they don't make the connection themselves, help them out by saying. Forget about them. Instead, focus your time and energy on what you can control. The only things you can control are yourself, your attitude, your appearance, your effort, your energy, your emotions. Brian Kane calls that your ape a PE. Get yourself and your players familiar with their ape. We all need to realize that success is determined by how well we control the controllable. Do that and let the outcome fall where it may. Knowing you did your part by understanding the competitive arena that you are in. By doing that, you can help direct your focus and those of your players to the process of performance. This knowledge cuts out all the unnecessary elements that most players focus on when they fail to understand the process over outcome approach and any given contest on the schedule can be looked at as a microcosm. Of the same process coaches and players during any lacrosse game. To use a Dr. Rob Gilbert phrase should focus on where their feet are. That means being in the moment in, intense fashion. Don't be worrying about what the score is or what's gonna happen 15 minutes from now. Focus on getting the next ground ball, making the right pass up the field, and getting that next goal and the next one after that. And the next one after that. This knowledge of focusing on what you can control and focusing on the process over the outcome is super powerful and will lead to more success than you could ever imagine. Just ask Coach Nick Saban and Coach Bill Tierney, they'll tell you the same. Now, we will return to our interview and you will find that interview in process.

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And yeah, and I would definitely imagine all your leadership skills being tested throughout the years has really come full circle for you as a lacrosse trainer up on these kids. I mean, it's probably, you can tell them so many real life stories that you've had that can help impact their life, right? Yeah. It's all, it all comes from what I've experienced. So I've, I've been, you know, I'm gonna turn 39 on on March 10th. Oh, you're a baby. And I know, I, you know, it's funny though. I was like, when my dad turned 40, I thought he was old as hell. You were thinking that I'm a year away and I feel like I'm 20 still. So it's pretty, you're never gonna not feel like you're 20. I mean, your knees and your shoulders might not, but like me and dog are getting really old. We, we think we're young, you know, you never really are gonna feel old in your head. I'm just gonna look it in my 39 years though I've gone through quite a bit. So I, I draw on all my experiences good and bad to help the kids that are in front of me on a daily basis, Right. Yeah. I know after looking at a few of your other interviews online that after Carolina you kind of went home to Long Island and were working for a year or two and then felt like you weren't really yourself and that you needed a change in scenery and then you move all the way out to California and you know, as you described, you went through a challenging and difficult period of time at that stage. And then getting through that, getting over that adversity. I know you're starting to write a book about your experience. I'm sure it's not just about that experience, but that's kind of a keystone of it. So tell us a little bit about that time after Carolina, and then what got you out to California? Well, the book is done. Oh wow. I just, you know, we, congratulations. Last, we're on our last bit of editing and stuff. I just had a, a meeting actually before this. We've got, the book has been turned down by 72 publishers. Our, it's just, it, we're not a big four sport. There's, they don't see enough audience for it. And that's the story of my life getting shut down and getting rejected and stuff like that. But this book's gonna be very successful. It's, it's, there you go. You're not gonna take no for an answer. Right. Oh, I love it. I'm actually gonna take all those rejections., I told the literary agents to send me all the rejections. I wanna read'em and I wanna put'em in the book.'cause when it, when it is, when it is successful, that's awesome. And that's, but that's how I'm right. You tell me I'm too small. I'm gonna three be wrong. That's, it's just like, like Mo some people would be crushed by that. Like, I was laughing on the Zoom call today. I was like, I was like, this is great. This is exactly what the book's about. It's about right. Becoming adversity and I I I love that. Right. That's great. So, so going back to college I, I graduated with a communications degree, still not knowing what I want to do in my life. And I actually stayed for an extra semester. The extra semester I get a call from a buddy at my from home. Telling me one of my best friends was shot and killed. Oh gosh. Sorry man. That just, wow. So Sean killed up in Albany, New York. So I graduated, not really, I don't know, in a, in a, in a rough way. I, I got a happy dose of reality in real life. Right, right. You know, entering the real world. So that happened I was graduating, so I had to fly home and bury my best friend and then fly back and, you know, get my diploma. Mm-hmm. And then, and then a month later you know, will, will, will Barrow was another good friend. And that happened a month later. Oh gosh. Yeah. So I buried two really good friends within a month's time. Mm-hmm. Yeah. And yeah, so that was the, the heavy, heavy dose of real life. And, you know, it put me, and I'm not, I look back at this, I'm not really proud of it, but getting, you know, I, I got to a really dark place you know, doing things out of my character. Mm-hmm. I lost my way. I I kind of escaped through drinking and, and other forms of numbing the pain. Mm-hmm. So I was, I was completely lost. I was working dead end jobs. Again, it's a gift and a curse for handling adversity. Right. You use your alumni. Network to get into the real world and jobs and work up the corporate ladder, whatever you want to do. And I, my, my, my dad's a carpenter by trade, and my mom was a teacher, so I didn't come from a lot of money. So I wanted to be kind of the breadwinner. I wanted to make a lot of money you know, be in the corporate world, be in finance, whatever it may be in Manhattan. And you know, I had all these networks that were willing to help me out. They knew what I was going through. They were willing to help me out. And I turned'em down because I told'em I wanted to do it myself. I wanted to do it on my own. I didn't take, I didn't take hand me outs. Now, being in the business world, knowing about that, this, this world is all about networking, right, right. Yeah. So, yeah, so I took a dead end job selling car insurance at Geico. I worked a couple jobs. Yeah. So it, it just, it was a time in my life that I don't like to talk about. It was just, it was a dark place. I dug, I dug a hole so deep, you know, that, you know, it was, it was. The only way to climb out was to start over. Right. So I decided to, I, I came home one night and I was disappointed in what I was doing. And I told my, it was actually my sister. I told my sister that I had to get out here. I'm gonna go to California, which is the furthest place away from New York. Right. Leaving three months. And she said, go, you need to just go and start over. So that's, that's what I did. I I saved a, a little bit of money for the next three months, and then I drove. And did you have like any connection to California? No, I had nobody out there. I don't, I didn't, I mean, I found, I found people once I was out that I didn't even know were out there. But yeah. That's great. I joined Cross Country with three other buddies and we started, it just started over. That's amazing. Well, Nick, man, I, I you know, I'm so grateful for you sharing what you shared. I, I really do think it's important for. Young kids to understand, you know, life can be tough and and you clearly went through some really challenging times and it's still so raw for you all these years later, you know? And so appreciate you sharing it because again, I, I think sometimes, especially as guys and athletes and tough guys, we're not supposed to talk about, you know, those, our feelings and those things that really impacted us. But I think, you know, there's so many people who struggle in different ways in their life and having people who have accomplished what you've accomplished despite all of it you know, it's, it's a, it's an important story to tell. So right. And then I think it probably, it's not easy than I appreciate, right? It's got really tough and, but I'm sure it adds such another layer to your experience that you can share with these kids, right? That it just makes you that much stronger. I mean, it's, really amazing. But go ahead Ron. I'm, I'm cutting you off. When you're ready to give your next question. Well, not only that, you cut me off when I was trying to tell Nick at a very emotional moment in our, in our Ron LAX history, just trying to be positive here, Jay. Good lord. Yeah. But anyway, Nick, thanks for sharing that, man. Really appreciate it. Well, I, I didn't, I didn't share it for so long. I, I buried it Yeah. A long time. I I actually started sharing it right bef, you know, right about when Covid hit, that's when I started opening up because I, I saw these kids struggling on a deeper level than what we were, I mean, what parents were seeing, what teachers were seeing, what coaches were seeing. It gave me the avenue to talk to them on a deeper level and kind of share my experiences, you know, once I figured out what was going on with them. And a lot of kids were in very dark places right. It's the thing I think we're taught to like tamp all that stuff down, right? So it's interesting how it was coming up to you as you're seeing these kids go through just a bigger struggle than most people would ever have gone through. So that's, that's pretty cool. So, so Nick, is it a, isn't it an exaggeration to say that, you know, you, you go out to California and, and is is finding physical training and lacrosse training, did that kind of get you back, get your mojo back in terms of things you loved and now you were sharing things you loved with other people? You know, what role did that play in kind of your rebirth, so to speak? It, it did eventually when I first moved out, I just needed to find a job and pay for rent. Yeah. Right, right. So I actually, I moved to California and the, the story goes like this. I I got, I took a job selling solar panels, door to door canvassing doors. Lacrosse was in the rear view mirror for me. I never thought I would pick up a stick again, to be honest. Wow. I was so burnt out after college then that happened and I was just, you know, I didn't think about it. I just thought about what's next. And yeah, I was too busy climbing my way outta the hole that I dug for myself. So it really wasn't, wasn't there. But I canvass at her house and I, I thank this lady for yelling at me this close to my face. She, you know, stopped soliciting at my door and like, yell, I mean, cursing. Every curse word came outta of her mouth. And I sat across. So she finally left, and then I went across the street and sat down. I was like, I don't want to do this right. I don't wanna do this. So I call my mom and I go, mom, I, I'm gonna quit this job. And, you know, she's obviously has more wisdom than I do at that age. And she told me, don't quit until you find another job. I call my other buddy and he is like, we're drinking Corona's on the beach in Huntington Beach. And I go, yep, I'm quitting. So I hand my clipboard to the guy, I go, I go drink on the beach in, in Huntington Beach, California. And I wake up on, you know, on the weekend and Monday comes around, I'm jobless and I got all these bills to pay and I'm like, I'm screwed. So I, I I hired a headhunter, got me a couple of corporate interviews. And this is where this comes back full circle as I'm sitting in the interview. And at this time I actually, I actually, I actually interviewed for a job in Manhattan that I got. It was nine interviews long. It was for like a financial advising. And I got the job out 300 applicants. It was like three people got got asked to, to come on board and I turned it out because I was gonna California. But I just, I was in a competitive mode of like seeing if I can get this high end job. So I was really good at interviewing. I, I knew what to tell people, what they wanted to hear, and so on and so forth. So I was at this Fortune 500 company and the last question she asked, she goes, where do you see yourself in five to 10 years? And I, I sat there for a minute and I thought, I really thought about it on the beach drinking Coronas. Holy kidding. And so I really thought about the question for a second, and I, and that's when it was kind of, that's, that was like my aha, aha moment of like, what do I love? What do I, I love strength and conditioning and speed because it helped me when I, when I had no answers, that was the only answer that got me to where I wanted to go. So I got my strength and conditioning. So she asked me, where do you see yourself in five to 10 years? And I go, and, you know, the answer is I see myself climbing up the corporate ladder, being a manager, a leader of a team, and, and you know, whatever that is for that company. And I told her, I said, in five to 10 years I see myself owning my own gym. And she goes, okay, well it was nice to meet, right? My head hunter calls me and goes, what the, what are you whatcha doing? I go, I found out what I wanna do. I'm gonna get, I'm gonna go get my strength and conditioning certifications. I'm gonna get my speed. And I really, my, my, my gift was speed change direction, stuff like that. So I really want to dive into the speed world, and that's what I did. So I I went to the first gym that I applied to. I went into it in, in like a, a, a meetup with them, and they hired me on the spot. They didn't hire me because I had my strength and speed certification. That was one that was, you know, it's a cherry on top, but my resume read All America UNC, lacrosse. Lacrosse, lacrosse. So they're like, we have a bunch of lacrosse athletes that need a lacrosse specific trainer. I was like, I don't, I don't, I don't do that. I, and they're like, well that's, that's, that's your resume and that's what we need you for. So if you don't wanna do that, then we don't have a job for you. So I I took it and started coaching both boys and girls lacrosse. And then That's funny. That's kind of when I, you know, the, I, I talk about this. You couldn't get away from it. You couldn't get away from it. It, it came after you. I got away, I got away for it for six years, but it came back into my life Right. When I needed it. I, I, right, right. Tend to tell people, you know, like we call it the medicine game and yeah, I never really paid attention to that or understood that, but I 100% believe that it was the perfect antidote for me at that time. Right. It got me back, it got a stick back in my hand. I was making$10 an hour. I was eating subway for lunch and dinner. So I was by, at the time it was$5 foot longs I was close to be. So I would order a$5 foot long and cut it in half, you know, have half for lunch and half for dinner. Barely have enough gas in my car to get to and from work. But I loved what I was doing. I was coaching kids, I was teaching'em speed, teach'em strength, getting some, some you know, some hours logging strength and speed, and then doing the lacrosse on the side and building the lacrosse thing. And then I start, you know, start getting these kids really good at lacrosse. And I'm, I'm starting to gain momentum and then I go to a couple games and watch. And then I started, you know, I was coaching a club team. I was coaching high school, and then I'm like on the sideline and I'm like getting more nervous than the kids are. And I'm like, those butterflies are like, I want to, I wanna compete again. I wanna play again.

MacBook Pro Microphone-3: 46:13

He wants to play again. He wants to compete again, but it's been a while since his UNC days. It's the age old question that haunts every athlete sooner or later, and that question is, does this old jalopy still have gas in the tank to find out? Tune in next week.

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Until we meet again. Here's to hoping you find the twine. We're signing off here at the get the lax scoop. Thanks again so much. We will see you the next time.